My ABC 20/20 comments

Have you ever gone to an auto repair shop for an oil change, only to have the mechanic say your car needs a new transmission? Has the “check engine” light come on, and suddenly the mechanic says you need expensive new engine parts?

One seasoned auto mechanic is warning consumers to be well-versed in how a car works to avoid being ripped off at the auto repair shop.

“Joe,” who has been a mechanic for 40 years, agreed to reveal the secrets of his trade to ABC News' “20/20” on the condition that his identity would remain concealed.

OK.  Hold on a minute. First, why does anyone that has something important to say have to hide his/her identity? There are problems in the auto repair trade, and just like any occupation or career there are some bad apples too and we would like nothing better for them to get the heck out of our trade and go away. The funny thing is when it comes to problems in the auto repair trade and exposing them “articles” like this one actually miss the mark entirely. If the authors really did their homework what they would have found is the biggest issue has to do with technician competency not honesty, and without real feedback this “article” would do more to hurt a consumers chances of having a talented and well trained technician service their car than it would help.

The auto repair trade has a significant shortage of qualified technicians. There are plenty of technicians who can handle the easier everyday services, but when it comes to the more technically challenging work there just isn’t enough techs to go around as compared to how many shops there still are. Now you might think this problem will just correct itself and who knows, maybe it would if we could get rid of all of the distractions that serve to derail the career track for the people who choose to try and become automotive technicians and that of course is the problem, the real problem that the authors should have been focusing on.

The career track to take someone from being an apprentice technician to eventually be the master technician that you the consumer needs your local shop to have in its repair bays doesn’t exist and hasn’t existed for the last twenty or thirty years. Now sure a few individuals have still made it but they are the exceptions and are a dying breed. Today’s prospective technicians can hope to at best specialize in one or two areas of service because there is simply too much for anyone to have to learn today. The idea of becoming a master technician that can work bumper to bumper and on all makes and models is an unachievable goal.    

He said some mechanics may try to squeeze more money out of customers by doing unnecessary repairs. What drives mechanics to cheat or push unnecessary repairs, Joe said, is the tiny profit margin at many repair shops. Most mechanics are honest, he said, but many are pressured by their bosses to perform unnecessary work.

There is some truth in the last couple of sentences, techs are pushed to perform “MPIs” which are multi-point inspections to try and make sure that a vehicle doesn’t leave with issues that should have been detected during a given visit. Part of the idea of the MPIs is to upsell Needed work and part of it is defensive in nature. Imagine a car came into a shop for a given issue and meanwhile the engine oil is a couple quarts low and several thousand miles overdue to be changed. What would you say about a mechanic/technician who didn’t check the oil and report that information, especially if there was then an engine failure in the next month or two that should have been prevented? You have to believe there are customers out there that would lay blame on the shop for missing that potential issue, just as sure as some others would jump on the other side of the issue and find fault with the shop for recommending the oil change. The difference right now is in this context of this essay there are finite limitations to the situation making the recommendation objective in nature, but in day to day service operations there is a subjective side to it that isn’t as easy to account for. This has some unintentional consequences for consumers when placed in context with the original ABC story and that is a junior technician concerned about making recommendations because they might be seen as overselling may in fact not make recommendations that he/she should have made. That ironically leaves the technician potentially (subjectively) wrong both ways, in other words, wrong if they advise additional work be done and at the same time wrong if they do not.  

 “The shop has to stay in business,” Joe said. “There are pressures to do things that maybe you wouldn’t do normally.”

Joe admitted that he has used shady tactics, himself, in the past.

“I’m ashamed a bit to admit it, but when your boss tells you ... 'Either you do it here or the door’s right there,' what are you going to do?” he asked.

Easy answer Joe, toolboxes have wheels on them for a reason. There are a lot of former technicians or ex-mechanics for a reason. There are bad managers out there who can run a shop in a way that produces significant profits, all the while ignoring what they are doing to the technicians that work for them. For the technicians in a shop like that they have made a terrible career choice in the best of times and it only gets worse when times are bad.

4. Jacking Up Repairs Based off the 'Idiot Light'

One of the most common, and profitable, ways to jack up a repair bill is exploiting fears over the “check engine” light, affectionately known by some in the trade as the “idiot light,” Joe said.

“The check engine light will direct you to a failure code,” he said. “Guys kind of have the phrase where every code deserves a part.”

Nonsense, real techs do not call the MIL (malfunction indicator light) anything other than what it is, a notification to the driver that the PCM has detected an issue because of an onboard test that failed.

“20/20” put the “idiot light” tactic to the test. Before heading out undercover, “20/20” had expert mechanic Audra Fordin purposefully unplug a cord to disconnect the mass airflow sensor in the engine of a “20/20” producer’s car, something that would be quickly detected and easy to fix. Both Fordin and Mendola deemed the car perfectly fine otherwise.

Well that’s fine for them to say that based on having all of the information in front of them and of course for causing the problem. But let’s look at it with real world experience. I’m betting that you can Google an engine symptom description of (one or more of the following) stalling, surging, hesitation and/or cuts out and you’ll get some tips to try unplugging the MAF sensor and see if the car runs better. If it does those tips will tell you to that either the MAF needs to be cleaned or replaced. (We don’t condone cleaning but the reasons go way beyond what can be explained here) Now given someone’s experience level and having a car come in the door with the MAF unplugged and otherwise running correctly that can falsely lead them to thinking it is bad based on past events. However in our opinion that doesn’t excuse them from not testing completely and correctly this time and discovering no other problems “at this time” other than the sensor being un-plugged. By the way, the key point in that last sentence is the “at this time”. Experience has proven that the sensor could be simply plugged back in with no trouble found right now, only to have the car come back in a week or two with the sensor genuinely failed and now the tech is at fault for not getting it right the first time. The rigged example that the ABC story is trying to rely on doesn’t take that into account either. On top of that it gets even better when we talk about what some of the shops did that solved the problem without upselling.  

One repair shop in New Jersey fixed the cord issue in 15 minutes without even charging our producer -- though ABC News' expert mechanic say it would be reasonable to charge between $50-100 to diagnose the problem.

This one sentence sets the stage for tying all of this together. The shop SHOULD have charged for what they did and by not charging the common thought is that somehow would earn them more business. The problem is there are many more just like them doing the same thing and in all of those shops that loss of revenue shows up at the bottom of the spreadsheet in classes that the techs won’t be sent to for continuing education, wages they won’t be paid, tools that won’t be purchased and ultimately more techs that won’t stay in the trade long enough to really get to be as good at fixing cars as you the consumer need them to be.  Now picture this as having gone on for the last twenty plus years and you should start to understand why there is a shortage of qualified people especially when it comes to the more difficult work. Combine that with the fact that it takes some fifteen to twenty years for the young technician just out of trade school to really learn to be the journeyman that you need him/her to be and that means if we could fix all of the problem tomorrow, there will still be a severe shortage for the next fifteen years, and if you think that it’s hard to get your car fixed now, just wait ten years and see what it is like when all of this really hits home.

 “The light was definitely on because of the sensor,” Mendola said. “And plugging it back in should have the solved the problem. ... I can give you an example. If you came home and your lamp wasn’t working and you realized, ‘Hey, somebody unplugged it from the wall,’ you wouldn’t go out and buy a new lamp. So basically, all you had to do was plug it back in and you’d be fine.”

The Sting and why it fails. Techs don’t fix rigged cars. If you want to run a test and try to make it accurate, you need a car that has developed a natural failure to do it with. The only thing the sting like this really proves is that people can be tricked especially with a marginally chosen “failure”. Give anybody enough chances and they will make a mistake (fail) on a test, especially if they don’t know a test is being given. Combine that with how many shops don’t charge for diagnostics correctly, (if at all) which means they don’t pay their techs correctly (if at all) for doing them and you should almost wonder why some actually get it right instead of just deriding the ones that fail.

Another attack on technicians, with no regard for the actual outcome.

here is the book on Amazon

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KEW9ENS

I haven't bought this book, nor will I. There is no reason to believe that anything new will be discussed in it. The one thing that I can agree with the author about is that good techs(mechanics) want the bad ones out because they ruin things for everyone. Where this book is going to fail, just like every other attempt to educate the consumer is that everyone lays the blame for the overselling on the technicians without really getting involved in examining why it happens. If that is never done the only thing that will continue to change is the number of qualified shops and techs who can repair vehicle problems when they occur.

Just imagine where the consumer will be without truly qualified technicians, who don't oversell and strive to do exactly what the customer needs each and every time. The dealerships and chain stores don't favor these people because their productivity is typically lower per hour than the ones who are selling services, while they demand a better pay rate and benefits. There are many reasons for that, not the least of which is the way the flat rate pay is managed especially at the dealerships. Imagine doing a major repair such as a head-gasket on an engine, or some internal transmission work. If it is customer pay "the book" allows for one labor rate, while warranty pays maybe half for the exact same job. They call it flat rate, but there is nothing flat about it and the technicians routinely get taken advantage of. Meanwhile they are being trained to sell services in order to make up the time that gets lost when they do a warranty repair. If they don't sell those services which they must do in order to be profitable by the end of the week, the technician can end up losing his/her job, even if they have perfect quality in their workmanship with the more difficult repairs.

Consumers will read that and quickly write it off as not their problem but that is because they aren't looking at the long term effects of the management practices that have been in place for the last twenty to thirty years. Today inside the trade we see a serious shortage of qualified technicians. The ones that are carrying the real high tech load are typically in their late 40's and up and life is going to do what life does and they will all too soon be gone from the trade.

What this author likely doesn't understand is that is exactly what the dealerships and the manufacturers want, because when you can't get your vehicle repaired efficiently and correctly that will drive sales of new cars. Some may think "so what", or they may think that it doesn't make sense for them to not have qualified techs to service their cars and generate resales. The facts are if someone is dissatisfied with their present vehicle, they worst they will do is switch to a different manufacturer for their next purchase. Meanwhile someone else will be doing the same thing in the other direction. That's a win/win for the manufacturers and the dealers at the consumers and the auto technicians expense.

There once was a time when there was a shop on every street corner. You don't see that anymore do you? Between the cars getting better and requiring less repairs and now longer service intervals, shops have been closing with no-one in line to replace them. There was once a time when a tech could have a career plan that ultimately lead to owning a business. That has all but been destroyed due in part to the cost of the tools and equipment required to open a shop, let alone the rent for (or cost of)  a properly zoned location. On top of that the wages produced by today's pay-scales for technicians puts that goal well out of reach. You might be paying $100/hr for their services, but most techs make under $20/hr. To add to the problems is the need to specialize inside the trade No-one can do it all anymore, and especially the idea that one can work on all makes and models. It is simply too expensive to tool up and train for even a handful of manufacturers and any business that cannot generate a return on its investment is doomed to fail. That makes the career of being an auto technician little more than a dead end job, that gets attacked at every turn, which BTW is all this author is really accomplishing with this book, and of course the feedback to it.

No one ever considers the natural reaction to the action of attacking the trade like this. Here is what the ultimate outcome from this book will be.

It is correct that overselling is wrong, no argument about that at all the author is right on the money with that perspective. But what constitutes over selling VS making correct inspections and advising the consumer about their car? IMO the latter is always going to be subjective opinions, nothing more, nothing less. When a tech, especially a younger one takes to heart the suggestion that selling is wrong they naturally stop selling completely and the result is in fact another wrong when they fail to recommend proper service that is truly needed on someones car and that ends up causing an otherwise preventable mechanical failure. The consumer involved may then go back to the shop laying appropriate blame on them and the result is another nail in that techs coffin and they move ever closer to doing something else with their lives. Think about it, how many times do you see someone say they that are an ex-mechanic? They demonstrate knowledge and passion, yet they weren't able to make a career as a technician. Isn't it time that someone starts asking why?

Lastly, doesn't it seem strange that the manufacturers and the dealerships never rebut these books and articles, in part or in whole? It's not because they agree or disagree with any of the points that get made. The facts are these things all lead right to where they want to be anyway, and that is a shorter turn over of the vehicle fleet. They don't want cars out there that last several hundred thousand miles and fifteen to twenty years (or more). They darn sure don't want people who can make them last that long either, because it is expensive for them to train and provide the equipment and tooling to do so, and they make more money selling the cars anyway. It takes decades to learn to be the technician that consumers need us to have, and as one former shop owner puts it we have become a trade that eats its own young. We haven't been attracting the people that we truly need to work on the high tech computerized systems that are on today's cars because as a career we have nothing to offer them compared to what they can earn in other fields. On top of that it takes a truly capable person some twenty years to master the trade and even if they started coming into it tomorrow, there is no reason for them to stay in it long enough to get good at it.

Instead of praising this author, thank her for helping to contribute to you being less likely to finding a great technician that can solve the difficult problems that can occur on today's cars. That is really the only thing that comes from any of these efforts because they never look at the actual cause for the problem and try and effect any changes where the blame really lies.

Myth, "You Can Clean a Catalyst".

The hard part is getting some "experts" to understand that it is their lack of understanding that allows them to believe in it.  From an e-mail related to a forum.


Hi Joe.



" I think the point being made in the forums about cat cleaning was only a desperate maneuver to pass
a smog test, not to restore a cat's efficiency."



That unfortunately isn't how it is presented either in the forum, nor especially via the advertising that the company that is promoting cataclean is putting out there.



When you wrote this



"It's entirely possible. Actually lacquer thinner works quite well, so maybe that's all that product is. I've also heard of people removing the CAT and dumping it overnight in a bucket of laundry detergent."



How should a reader interpret your post? It sure looks like you thought that cleaning catalysts was possible.



RB had written" ."Fast forward to late December where at around 158,500 miles the truck started throwing an intermittent SES light. I ran it over to the dealer and my Service Advisor told me that the fault was the dreaded “catalyst efficiency” DTC. I had resigned myself to spending a few hours under the truck trying to install spark plug anti-foulers(and cursing the stuck O2 sensors) when I ran across an ad for Cataclean: http://www.cataclean.com/ It was apparently developed in England and is now sold over here by Mr. Gasket and Prestolite"



Instead of pointing out that is tampering and not only has an impact on the systems ability to test the catalysts correctly, it totally ignores the fact that testing of the catalysts is only a small part of the responsibility of the downstream sensors. Your post makes it appear that you supported his statements. If you want XXXXX to truly educate the consumers, then you shouldn't be standing by and supporting the myths like RB posted. Did " the cleaner", make a difference? The answer is, if it did it didn't occur inside the catalyst and if you knew that you shouldn't have let his comments stand unchallenged.  



Look up this code. DTC P2096.  Use any platform that supports it, and then explain what would happen if someone tampers with the location and therefore the exhaust sampling of the downstream O2 sensors. 



You wrote" You know, some folks don't have $1700 to spend, so if some snake oil gets
them passed the Smog Monster, even for a few weeks, all well and good."



Sure I know some folks don't have that kind of money laying around, but they also don't have the money for another car payment which is where they will end up if manufacturers and dealers have their way. Proper education, service and care would decrease the occurrences of the major failures be they mechanical or emissions related. Your Mini wouldn't have lost it's catalyst to a major failure had you been more attentive to a misfire that occurred in the past. You are looking at your catalyst failure as its own single event, when in fact that kind of a failure is caused by something else and should be preventable.

Just a little update

It's been really busy the last few weeks, so I haven't had much time to write. I have more to put up from the last few posts to complete the stories, but in the mean time here are a few pictures from work we did in the shop this week.

This is from a 2011 Subaru Outback that the customer was reporting difficulty shifting into first gear. A short trip around the block revealed noise from the throw out bearing. If it wasn't for this bearing failing, the clutch itself would likely have lasted a few more years. I'll add more to this this story during the coming week.

Here are a few photos from some of the repairs we did this week.

This is the connector that was found to be dropping the power and ground connections for the canister vent valve on a 2002 Ford Explorer. Can you see the other problem that we addressed at the same time?

 

These captures are from a 2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser with a 2.4l turbo.

Close examination alongside a known good waveform shows that the cams are out of time.

 

Here is the pressure transducer with the crank sensor and the cam sensor.

A Weatherbug Spring Auto Tip.

We got to the shop this morning and found this on weatherbug.

http://weather.weatherbug.com/weather-news/weather-reports.html?zcode=z6286&story=8134

Well they asked for a reply, so why not?
................................................................
Who wrote that article? Does he/she actually have any formal training to work on cars?

O2 sensors:

     "Faulty sensors are the most common reason for a failed emissions test. Precise oxygen sensors can increase your mileage efficiency by an average of 10-15 percent. Replacing a faulty oxygen sensor is easy and costs between 60-80 dollars on average, which is inexpensive compared to the amount of gas money it can save. The most obvious way to know when your oxygen sensor needs to be replaced is if the "check engine" light appears, but they should ideally be replaced every 50,000 miles." 


    Nobody should just on a whim replace an O2 sensor,  or as they are more correctly named on most cars today an air/fuel ratio sensor. The cost to replace some of those components isn't the fifty or sixty dollars as suggested by the article but quite often can approach three hundred dollars per sensor. Besides, the computers on today's cars constantly test the performance of these sensors so they should be left alone until either the PCM reports them as failing or if a emissions control specialist technician proves that they need to be attended to. With today's cars some of the O2 and air fuel sensors have the potential to be lifetime components. That essentially means if your author was a tech and doing that work for someone else, the advice given would be a rip-off of that vehicle owner.

Spark Plugs:

"Spark plugs are good indicators of engine condition. Spark plugs should be checked every 30,000 miles, even if your car is low-maintenance."

    In many cars scheduled maintenance for the spark plugs occurs at the 100,000 mile range, not 30,000. Plus many engine designs today have the spark plugs buried under the upper intake manifold and you need an experienced hand to deal with some of these because of the complexity at even that level.

Engine Oil:

"Oil filters: Oil filters are easy to replace and can help prevent unnecessary wear and tear of the engine. Oil filters should be replaced with engine oil every 3,000 miles."

   Extended oil drain intervals are the norm today and the old 3 month or 3000 mile has been inaccurate for at least a decade. We have O.E. recommendations that run from the 5000 mile range to as much as 15000 miles. In fact there are some manufacturers maintenance reminder systems that could allow a car to go even further mathematically, but in practice routinely average 11,000. The real advice that should have been given would have the writer explaining to the readers how to choose the correct oil for their car so that it meets all of the O.E. requirements. Today vehicle owners cannot just grab any oil that shows their recommended viscosity on the front label.

Filters:

    "Air filters: Cars run on both gas and oxygen. If the flow of air is blocked by a clogged air filter, a car`s performance and fuel efficiency will go down. Air filters should be checked and replaced every 12,000 miles."

     A dirty air filter does not impact fuel mileage. Now power, maybe but mileage no. We have cars on the road today that do not have a scheduled air filter replacement. The ones that do it is often in the 30,000 and as much as 50,000 mile intervals.

    "Transmission filters: A blocked transmission filter can produce transmission slippage, engagement problems and engine hesitation. This filter should be changed every 12-15,000 miles to extend the life of your automatic transmission."

    Transmission filters on many designs are not serviceable without major disassembly and are considered a lifetime component, only to be addressed if the transmission needs a repair.


#weatherbug, #O2 Sensor, #transmission, #service, #air filter, #engine oil, #gas

The Impala, part #2

     The main question asked at this point is how to proceed. It quite often happens that the information that is passed onto the technician about the symptoms that a car is displaying turns out to not match what was initially described to him/her. The Airbag (SRS) and ABS lights flashing on, instead of the turn indicators suggests a completely different issue, and the scan tool is now the next thing to bring into play.


     So connecting the TechII scan tool, and going straight for the Airbag system there was no communication found with that module. Other systems were communicating on the data bus, and they of course had active codes for the airbag module communication failure and historical codes for multiple modules losing communication. When a module has fallen off of the data bus the thing to do is confirm power and grounds. In this case with the turn signals are also being affected, looking for something common to both systems makes for a logical plan and what they share is the same power connection from the ignition switch. The fuse for the turn signals is in the fuse block on the drivers end of the dash, and measuring power on that fuse showed 7v. Meanwhile any fuse that wasn't getting power from the pink wire pin "B" of connector #2  was a showing battery voltage of 12.2v. That's a big voltage drop to that circuit.


     The customer was then brought to the car and shown what we had found, she didn't have a turn signal issue, she had an ignition switch problem that was even shutting down her alternator at times and it was a good thing we squeezed this in. It was kind of fun to show her the turn signals not working, which is the symptom that she noted, then show her the airbag module not having communication with the scan tool, and then by jumping power to the turn fuse, all of the systems that were affected came back to life. When the jumper was removed, they all shut right back down, which by the way is exactly what the car was going to do to her real soon, stall out and leave her stranded somewhere. That pin of the ignition switch also powers up the fuel injection system, and all she had to do was drop just a little more power and that would have shut the engine down too. At this point it was time to get a charger on the battery, and get a new switch ordered and installed and we had her back on the road in a couple hours.


#Tech II , # Airbag, #ignition, #ignition switch, #SRS, #battery, #module, #fuse, #jumper wire, #data bus, #turn signal